YWJ: Does the Christian church—and, by extension, American culture as a whole—encourage fiscal responsibility, or prohibit it?

Cruz: There are many groups that have dedicated themselves to providing financial education for students, starting as early as the elementary grades. But you do have the powerful forces of marketing and advertising, whose goal, of course, is to sell products. I also think that one of the effects of technology is that everything is instantaneous. You can go to the Internet and communicate instantly with people around the world. And that is fantastic, but it creates an expectation of instant “do it now, don’t wait.” And that’s where we need to fight the battle.

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Ramsey: Most normal people, Christian or no, are just plain broke because they are in debt, up to their eyeballs. The Bible says, “The borrower is servant to the lender.” If you’re in debt then you’re a slave, in the sense that you do not have the freedom to use your money to do what God may be calling you to do.

YWJ: Youth workers and youth pastors aren’t getting rich doing what they do. Can they really get ahead on their meager income?

Ramsey: Unfortunately, the word “budget” has gotten a bum rap. It is basically just a plan. When you budget, you’re spending on paper, on purpose, before the month begins. Many people view a budget as a straight jacket that keeps them constrained. However, when you see that a budget is just spending your money with intention, you’ll actually experience more freedom than before.

Cruz: I have a lot of experience not having money. We came to the U.S. in 1960, I did not know English and my parents left everything behind. They came here with exactly $300. It took several months of savings just to buy a mattress. No matter how little you make, though, it’s always possible to set a goal and set at least 5 percent of your money aside. Some people say, “How can I save when I need all my money to live on?” If you cannot live on 100 percent of your income, you also cannot live on 95 percent—so you might as well save the five [percent].

YWJ: Let’s talk about young people and some of the common financial pitfalls they encounter. How would you recommend teens and young adults deal with, say, student loans?

Ramsey: If you want to make sure your college years are pleasant, you’ll need to avoid student loans. The average college graduate, in 2002, walked across the platform with $23,000 in debt before they get their first job! That’s a terrible way to begin a career. To avoid loans, start with grants and scholarships. Secondly, work part-time as needed. Third, attend a local, affordable college first to get the first couple of years of required classes over with, then transfer to the school of your dreams—if you can pay cash.